Sent by Abyss on 6 January 2005 22:10
More then one reply in this email..so read down...
>> I know the CSS2 @media type is handheld
>>
>> but it seems to be disobeying that....does anyone know why?
>
> Yes - browser-developers ignores the standard media type. It is as
> simple as that.
>
>> is there another media type that i am missing?
>
> Most implementations use @media screen, and try to reformat
> screen-styles to suit small screens. It usually looks like crap, as
> you've noticed.
>
> AFAIK, only Opera use @media handheld, and will render pages in
> accordance with those styles. Opera also reformat pages without @media
> handheld quite well, but once the correct, standard, media type is
> present, it will be rendered in accordance with that.
> Opera has a pretty well-working test-rendering for small screens, SSR,
> in the standard, large screen, browser-versions.
>
> For more on the subject:
> http://www.alistapart.com/articles/pocket/
>
> regards
> Georg
Dear Georg,
Thank you for the reply..
That Sucks! why have the standard if they do not use it :(
Abyss
> The media type you're using is correct. I see you're using @media
> exclusively. Browser support for the @media rule is flaky at the best of
> times (i.e. for desktop browsers) and is worse for handheld browsers. I'd
> recommend using <link> for defining media-specific rules:-
>
> http://css-discuss.incutio.com/?page=MediaStylesheets
>
> I'm not clear what development kit you are using. If it emulates handheld
> display, remember that emulation will give little more than an "artist's
> impression". Test in Opera as well, both for your own handheld rules and
> for its fallback emulation (Shift-F11 Small Screen Rendering). Actual
> devices will give very diverse results:-
>
> http://css-discuss.incutio.com/?page=HandheldStylesheets
>
> You've chosen to work in a very challenging area! Keep it simple and
> unambitious until handheld browsers improve.
>
> --
> Jim Wilkinson
Dear Jim
Thank you for confirming the correct media - thought I was...i have spent way too much time
reading...no wait..decoding W3C
documentation.
And hand held was the one that best suited it..amoungst all of them.
With the at media rule though, I cant say i agree 100% with you on that because i do not know what
browsers you are testing it in.
I have tested the at media rule in IE6, NS7.1, Opera7.54, and FF1.0 and have all found that they are
using the @ rule without any problems.
Infact only recently I had a problem that Olivier from the W3C validater helped me to solve with the
style sheet.
The style sheet was followed so well(in regards to @ media type) and with such rigidness that I was
quit shocked about it..
with IE6 holding a 65% grasp I think that it is pretty safe to say that the @ media rule is
followed
and anyone else who uses other browser types(that possibly use browser that are flaky)
would upgrade them as new version numbers come out, which would support the at media rule,..but
like i said earlier, I have
tested the sites in a number of browsers and they seem to handle the @ media well....meaning they
work..I might even be bold enough
to say that they work 99% of the time(in the browsers i tested in) which is unusual with web :)
Im just waiting for Opera developers to get their fingers out and put out the next Opera, so that
transparent wmode (for flash) will work in it.
Thanks for your reply Jim
Abyss
ps the phone development kit is http://developer.openwave.com/
Dear Karen
The article on designing for small screens mentioned by Georg is a great one
I hadn't seen. I tried to add it to the Handheld Wiki but can't figure out
how to get past the new anti-spam system :-) Maybe Jim can do it.
Here's what I was going to add:
[http://www.alistapart.com/articles/pocket/ Pocket-Sized Design: Taking Your
Website to the Small Screen] A great article pointing out the advantages of
using css for small devices along with ways to use css on small screens
effectively. Also check the related links at the bottom of the page for more
info.
Karen Stevenson
http://www.elderweb.com/
Nice article...
Thanks
Abyss
I'll be honest with everyone here..
I think browsing the web via mobile phone is a bit odd(at least for me anyway), it takes me 5
minutes to type a single word on
a mobile phone for a SMS.
The email part for phones is good, as they are very similar to text messages
but not browsing the web - unless it is picking up simple things like "movie showing times."
or something that requires a very very very small amount of data.
By the looks of it to me, we are going back to the old days of building the same website 2-3 times
with the same content
(remember the good old days(good as in you could charge the client double the money) of 1 site for
NS and the other for OE?)..
because if the handhelds do not obey the @media handheld css you have to hook up something similar
to (fake link next)
http://mobile.abyss.ws and have the second version of the website for the phones under that.
I personally would not use the internet on a phone, I do not want a stubby thumb by the end of one
browsing session.
but one must keep up with the technology...
Anyway thanks for your input all.
Abyss
http://www.abyss.ws/
PS Jim, did abyss work in your browser ok? if you are having problems I would love to know about it
if possible
constructive feedback is always welcomed...
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