Sent by Eric A. Meyer on 12 December 2004 17:05
At 11:34 +0000 12/12/04, Bob McClelland wrote:
>OK, I'm going over the top here, for effect, but the only difference between
>tables and divs seems to be that tables are supposed to be for 'data',
>according to W3C specs.
All true, particularly the "over the top" part. I would say (and
have said repeatedly) it's also the case that sometimes, a simple
table is the best solution to a problem. Other times, it's not
necessary.
For this list, the focus should be on helping people understand
what the best choice will be for their particular situation. So if
Joe Designer posts saying "how do I make this layout work in CSS?",
and it's difficult or impossible to accomplish given current CSS
support in browsers, then the best answer is to say, "That's not
really possible because of browser bugs unless you use a simple
table; here's how you might want to do it instead." If someone asks
how to do something without a table, and it's possible to do it
without a table even if doing so is convoluted, the best answer is
"Here's how, but you might want to consider using a simple table,
because the way I just explained is overly complex." Case in point:
<http://www.meyerweb.com/eric/css/discuss/examples/notable-calendar.html>,
which was constructed to show why a monthly calendar is almost
certainly better being marked up as a table-- but, at the same time,
showing how to do it without one if the reader is really committed to
the idea.
What shouldn't happen on this list is a long argument over the
goodness and evilness of tables. And, for that matter, table-driven
design should only come up here as a last resort-- not because it's
evil, but because there are about a zillion resources on the Web
regarding how to do table-driven design. Odds are that most of us
here know how to do table-driven design. The goal of the list is to
learn CSS.
I'm about 90% ready to end this thread on the basis of its subject
line alone, since it's clearly inflammatory. However, if the
discussion can focus on providing links to resources that help
clarify the issues of when tables are more useful than not, I'll let
it continue. If it continues to veer away from the practical or
devolves into a flame war, I'll stop it.
To help with the resource-link effort, I'll throw out a few posts
I made a while back. I do not claim these are the final word on the
subject, nor for that matter even necessarily the epitome of
intelligent thinking. They're a mixture of practical advice and
opinion, and are simply extra data points for anyone who wants to
read up on this area and come to their own conclusions about what's
best for them.
http://www.meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/09/03/sliding-faux-columns/
http://www.meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/09/05/css-grids/
http://www.meyerweb.com/eric/thoughts/2004/09/06/to-be-tabled/
Remember: I'm posting these to keep the theory off the list. Any
arguing with me about statements made should also be done off-list.
And as I say, if people can contribute more links, that would be
great. We could turn them all into a new css-d wiki page, or else
update <http://css-discuss.incutio.com/?page=TablesVsDivs>, so that
interested parties will have more information at their disposal.
--
Eric A. Meyer (http://www.meyerweb.com/eric/), List Chaperone
"CSS is much too interesting and elegant to be not taken seriously."
-- Martina Kosloff (http://www.mako4css.com/)
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